Dr. Marisela Gomez is community activist, public health professional, and physician-scientist. She received her MD-PhD and MPH from Johns Hopkins University Schools of Medicine and Public Health. Drawing on 17 years of activism-research in East Baltimore, her writings address social capital and health, disparities in mental healthcare in incarcerated populations, and mindfulness practices in community organizing and development. She is a co-author of “Healing Our Way Home” and a meditation/Buddhist teacher.
499: Mindfulness for Personal Healing
Dr. Marisela Gomez
Every day, in every interaction, we are transmitting energy to those around us—our kids, our family, our friends take on a bit of what we are giving. So how can we transform the energy of anxiety, hurt, frustration and more so that we can add more peace into our lives? Hunter talks to Marisela B. Gomez about the power of mindfulness and self care to heal.
Ep 499 Mindfulness for Personal Healing- Dr. Marisela Gomez
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*This is an auto-generated transcript*
[00:00:00] Dr. Marisela Gomez: Sometimes I wonder, like, why did I have to go that wrong? Cause it's all part of it. It's the path, right? Why did it take me so long to just sit down and be still? Which is what we start moving to in mindfulness and meditation. But then once I did sit down and stop and pause and look, the benefits of it was immediate. So wow, there's like something to this thing here.
[00:00:33] Hunter Clarke-Fields: You're listening to The Mindful Parenting Podcast, episode number 499. Today we're talking about mindfulness for personal healing with Marisela B. Gomez, MD.
Welcome to The Mindful Parenting Podcast. Here it's about becoming a less irritable, more joyful parent. At Mindful Parenting, we know that you cannot give what you do not have, and when you have calm and peace within, then you can give it to your children. I'm your host, Hunter Clarke-Fields. I help smart, thoughtful parents stay calm so they can have strong, connected relationships with their children.
I've been practicing mindfulness for over 25 years, I'm the creator of the Mindful Parenting course, and I'm the author of the international bestseller Raising Good Humans and now Raising Good Humans Every Day, 50 Simple Ways to Press Pause, Stay Present, and Connect with Your Kids. Welcome back to the Mindful Parenting podcast.
Hey, of course, as always, if you get something out of this, share it with a friend. It really makes such a huge difference. And if you're new, a big welcome. I hope you enjoy this episode. There's obviously, who's episode 499? Holy moly. There's so much to go back and listen to, so please do go back and listen.
Today, we're going to be talking to Marisela B. Gomez, community activist, public health professional, and physician and scientist, and she received her MD, PhD, and MPH from Johns Hopkins School of Medicine and Public Health, and she is the coauthor of Healing Our Way Home and a Meditation of Buddhist Teacher. And in today's conversation, we're going to talk about how every day and every interaction, we are transmitting energy to those around us, to our kids, our family, our friends, and how all those people take on a bit of what we're giving. So how can we transform the energy of anxiety, of hurt, of frustration, and more so that we can add more peace into our lives? So we're going to talk about the power of mindfulness and self care to heal. I know that this will be a very small soothing and wonderful conversation for you. So let's dive right in.
Are you passionate about parenting and maybe want to become a parenting coach? Perhaps you're a teacher, a therapist, doula, or simply a parenting junkie. then let me tell you about the Mindful Parenting Teacher and Coach Training Program. It's a five month intensive program that can be done from anywhere around the world and gives you everything you need to bring mindful parenting to the people in your life.
Here's what people have said about it:
[00:03:22] Mindful Mama Member: The program that really drew me in was that it wasn't just on, like, how do we practice mindfulness. It incorporated the communication and the problem solving and, went a lot deeper. It was really, amazing to be going through this process and have that, weekly support that extended beyond just our teacher training, really. The whole process was really well laid out and organized and having the materials from a teacher perspective was really nice as well. The course is so thorough like you're given every single bit of material that you could possibly need.
[00:03:59] Mindful Mama Member: This is really a community reaching far and wide. And I think that this program, because it works on decreasing your inner stress response and taking care of yourself, so then you can give that back to your children and model that behavior for your children as they're growing up into adulthood. Just seeing the positive changes in my own family and knowing that, as I continue to spread that into the community, that will be, like, just even more far reaching.
[00:04:23] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Enrollment is open now and there are limited spots available. Step into your dream of becoming a Mindful Parenting coach. Find out more at mindfulparentingcourse.com/teach. That's mindfulparentingcourse.com/teach.
Maricela, thank you so much for coming on the Mindful Parenting Podcast.
[00:04:55] Marisela Gomez: Thank you, Hunter, for having me.
[00:04:57] Hunter Clarke-Fields: So I'm excited to talk to you about, about creating peace and things like that in ourselves and, but I'd like to start out every conversation thinking about we, talk a lot about our generational patterns and, and, how we, take from the last generation, what we may not want to take from the last generation. How were you raised and what was your childhood like?
[00:05:26] Marisela Gomez: I was raised in a very Catholic, very Catholic family. Yeah. That was my religion. I was born and raised in Belize in the Caribbean. And so the majority spirituality or, tradition there, religious tradition, one of the majority was Catholicism. So that was my upbringing into spirit world. and was practicing, with Catholicism pretty, I'd say in a dedicated way till I was about 13, when I came to this country, to the U. S. and I really enjoyed Catholicism. I wanted to be a nun, actually. If I had stayed in Belize, I probably would have gone that route. My aunt was a Catholic nun, so I was around a lot of nuns growing up, being bounced around on their knees as a, child or as a kid. yeah.
[00:06:34] Hunter Clarke-Fields: And what kind of, What kind of upbringing did you think you would describe your parents parenting as?
[00:06:45] Marisela Gomez: Yeah. So I was actually raised by my grandparents. My parents left the country when I was two years old to come to the U.S. to, yeah, make, as they say, a better life for us. So I was raised by my grandparents. So I think, I was actually lucky and unlucky in the sense of at two years old, having your parents leave is quite traumatic. but my grandparents having that generation that's already raised three children, and some other kids and having. The wisdom of having gone through it once before, I feel very lucky and blessed, in that my grandparents were, wonderful, they loved me and my brothers dearly, they could spoil us, I think, in a way that grandparents do, that parents aren't quite doing because of just, they're trying to get us to understand life and what's required. The grandparents have, at least my grandparents, had the wisdom of having that experience and I felt very loved. I'm very cared for. My grandmother, was a home, worker, meaning she stayed at home, took care of us, cooked and cleaned and all that. But by the time that we were growing up, my grandfather had already retired. He was older. So actually had both of them around most of the time. Yeah. So I would consider, besides. That very abrupt leaving of my parents, I would consider that I had a very, actually lovely and nourishing, childhood, with my grandparents. And, they were very much like my parents until we came to the States to then be with my parents.
[00:08:52] Hunter Clarke-Fields: That's interesting. Yeah. I guess grandparents, that can be that way that they can be a little bit more relaxed by the time maybe they get around to their grandchildren and maybe they're a little tired. Although, I remember spending some time with my grandparents and them just being so much more rigid in some ways than my parents.
Like we went through this whole thing one time when I was little where I was with my grandparents and they wanted me to wear a skirt or a dress- because I didn't like wearing skirts and dresses when I was little and they wanted me to wear a skirt or a dress and they said okay we won't be going out to ice cream if you don't wear a skirt or a dress and I was like you know in my head I'm my little head I'm sure I was like very much F- you I'm gonna you know my remember my brother was like Hunter, please! This is ice cream we're talking about. Put on the dress, who cares? And I would not do it, and it was very much a battle. They were, in some ways, more rigid than my parents, about some things, I don't know, I guess it could go either way.
[00:10:02] Marisela Gomez: No, I, my grandparents made sure we, they laid down the law of the land. I didn't feel, it's not that I didn't get, back then, back in the day, they did, you'd get, a spanking. so it's not like I didn't get my share of that, for not following directions. but I always felt, it's funny if you feel that people love you even as a kid, I feel. I knew, I always knew my grandparents loved me very much. and maybe it was a sort of clinging to that because my parents had left. I don't know. but I always felt loved by my grandparents. so even when I misbehaved and I did, like any other kid, not doing what I was supposed to do and always wanting to be outside playing with the boys and, not doing enough housework, which is the girls were supposed to do.
And the boys, my brothers didn't have to make their own beds. I'd sometimes have to go make their own. I know, right? Yeah. but that was, that was the lay of the land, But even then, I'd say, I don't want to do it. Then I'd get. I get in trouble for talking back, because that was the role, cleaning and whatnot. So it's not that I didn't have any discipline or didn't have clear boundaries and the direction as to how. I was supposed to behave as a little girl. I didn't quite stick to that. I got into my own mischief and, I still felt the leniency and the acceptance. I guess maybe that's what I feel is, maybe they can see beyond, the, the, rigidness of you do it this way and you do it that way and allow that movement in between.
[00:12:17] Hunter Clarke-Fields: So then how did you come to find a spiritual practice with Buddhism?
[00:12:22] Marisela Gomez: that was, much, much later, actually. it was in the 90s. I, started, a friend gave me a book. Oh, it's always like that, or often like that. Someone gave me, It's-
[00:12:37] Hunter Clarke-Fields: usually a book.
[00:12:39] Marisela Gomez: Yeah. Someone gives you the book and say, you need this, go do something with it. Someone gave me a book and, early nineties, I believe. And, but I didn't start to practice. Like I didn't meditate or go to a community to learn how to do it or anything like that. I just read it.
[00:13:00] Hunter Clarke-Fields: How old were you when you got your book?
[00:13:03] Marisela Gomez: I would say I was in my late twenties, maybe early, early thirties. but I didn't, I was, I studied it and I really, I'd say for the first nine years of my exposure to Buddhism, it was really just reading. Didn't go to a community of practice didn't find other people doing it, it was more an intellectual study, more like really looking at the philosophy of it, understanding it, reading many different, types of Buddhism, and getting more, just understanding this whole new world of Eastern philosophy, so it wasn't until 2000 that I actually went to a meditation place, a place where people gather to meditate together, sit together, what we call Sangha, community practice. So it took me that long, to actually realize that this path of practice is really a practice. it's not a study only.
[00:14:23] Hunter Clarke-Fields: That's what's funny because I have such a similar story. Like I picked up a book when I was a teenager, when I was 17. I think I got, Thich Nhat Hanh's book, Being Peace, little, very simple, wonderful little book. And I read that book and then a bunch of other books after that for about a decade. And then after a decade, I ended up doing a yoga teacher training and then I was like, Oh, and then I was able, I can actually do this meditation thing. And I actually, that's when I finally sat down to practice and, lo and behold, it is much better as a practice than just reading. And I'm sure you found out the same thing.
[00:15:03] Marisela Gomez: So different, what comes from the practice, It's remarkable actually. And sometimes I wonder like, why did I have to go that wrong? Not wrong, because it's all part of it. It's the path, right? why did it take me so long to just sit down and be still? which is, what we start mindfulness and meditation. But that, was it. I'm pretty stubborn. Sometimes it takes me a long time to get things right. and, but then once I did sit down and stop and, pause and look, the benefits of it was immediate. So wow, there's like something to this thing here. let me go do it again and again.
[00:16:01] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Stay tuned for more Mindful Mama podcast right after this break.
[00:19:00] Marisela Gomez: So it's a big lesson for me is that the path is not something to be studied. It's something to be done and practiced. yeah.
[00:19:10] Hunter Clarke-Fields: What were you seeking and what were some of those benefits that you experienced so immediately?
[00:19:17] Marisela Gomez: I was going through a very, actually when I first started practicing is when I, had more time, actually, when I started practicing So I was in a job where I could take more time from studies. I had been in graduate school and then medical school, residency. And, there wasn't a whole lot of time for, extra time, if you will. but then in residency, things started opening up, especially the second year. And then I started, working after residency and I actually had a job that paid, real money. And I had real time, something I hadn't really had before that. and then I started having time to go to Sangha, to go sit and, be still and had money to travel to places, which I think is also an important. part of this story for me and for many others like me is that, to go to sanghas, to go to retreats, it requires money and time. And if you don't have those two things, you sometimes can't access, which is one of the reasons this book was written is to really talk about how do we make, how do we make this beautiful path, this path of transformation and healing more accessible for people. who don't have the time and who don't have the resources to access it.
[00:21:05] Hunter Clarke-Fields: And what were some of those benefits that you experienced so immediately you said?
[00:21:12] Marisela Gomez: I immediately started, so I was very angry, and, I think I've just been angry my entire life. And, what I found was as I was reading and starting to practice, I actually w I wouldn't get so, angry.
There was actually a pause. There was more spaciousness. I could see that I was angry and in that seeing, I could decide, is that really what I wanted to do was be, anger, previously, without the, ability to, stop and observe ourselves, Sometimes we don't see who we really are. We're just who we've been. and we don't even know that we can change. but that's what sitting and, stopping did was. It gave me this pause to notice myself, to notice, Oh, do you see how angry you are? maybe your, body is doing this from this situation or that situation and starting to make connections that, when you stay in your head, you don't know what else is happening in your body. And sometimes if you get out of your head and notice what's happening in your body, it's actually. The first step to healing, because you see the body is showing, it's telling you there's something else going on here, but that's what, those are some of the things people were starting to tell me that I wasn't as angry. And in some places I wasn't angry enough. because in some spaces of social justice work, you're, you're assessed as a good person. Worker for justice, depending on how angry you are, they're really angry people. They'll get out there and they'll do anything and et cetera. And, I had that energy, that fire. And, some people around me were saying, Oh, Marisela, you don't seem angry, as angry as you used to be. I don't know if you're angry enough. And I thought. Okay, this is, this is something I have to look into, but thankfully, I didn't listen to that. I, cause something of benefit was making me know that, that was okay. I didn't, just because I'd been like that my whole life. And people knew me like that, it didn't mean that I had to stay like that. And that's actually a very, profound, insight, to just know that the way we've been most of our lives is not the way we need to be the rest of our lives. It's a deep teaching of Buddhism, right?
That emptiness makes everything possible. so we can always change. Nothing is permanent. It's a beautiful teaching and it's a beautiful truism, I think about Buddhism and mindfulness.
[00:24:41] Hunter Clarke-Fields: I agree. I agree completely. And for the listener, the teaching that emptiness makes everything possible, the word emptiness might be a little bit of a wait a second, what are you talking about? That might've caused a few question marks over some heads. And I'll, if you don't mind, I'll share my understanding of that, which is, that, when the Buddha talked about emptiness. He meant the, that we are empty of a separate self. There is not a, that things are all inter are. We are not, we are not separate from everything and, the teaching on, emptiness means that change is always possible. Change is always happening and constantly happening. There’s nothing permanent to hold on to and therefore that, that, that leads to what you were saying that this idea that change is, always, possible. I really relate to your story in a lot of ways because that's what I was working on enormously with my daughter when my daughter was younger was my anger, was the anger that would arise and the guilt and shame I felt over that and the, the power of the tools of mindfulness to help us to transform that and to calm that reactivity and, but also to, to give you, give me more understanding as to where this came from and, it wasn't something I chose.
It was something that was, had arisen through all these causes and conditions. And yeah, there was still, something I had to take responsibility for. But anyway, it sounds like our anger was in different, obviously very different circumstances, but it was also something I, dealt with was, was anger, was, on, being able to accept that this energy, this fire was in me and that, that's okay.
That's like part of being human and part of life is to have all these, experiences and all these emotions. And how can I do that? How can I transform this energy? Would you agree? And then, may you correct me if you under, on my understanding of emptiness, or my description of emptiness, if you want.
[00:27:08] Marisela Gomez: Oh, no, I, agree. Thai and Vietnamese means teacher. And, the, Buddhist tradition that, that, I practice in, and sounds like you also, Hunter, is, started by Thai Thich Nhat Hanh, who's a venerable Zen master from Vietnam. And so we, who practice in this tradition, call him Thai, and he passed two years ago. And, we remember him for all the beautiful ways that he brought mindfulness to the West in a very accessible way for most of us, to heal. and one of the ways that I, that he had, I think, helped us make it accessible, these, deep and transformative teachings is, the way he describes emptiness.
And if you look at a flower, it's not. It doesn't have a true self nature, because if you look deeply into the flower, that it's made up of the seed that was planted, the water that nourished it, the soil that it was planted in, the little worms that, did their thing in the soil to make the pH just right, the rain and the sun, and the person who planted it. it's made up of all that. So if we'd really, We look deeply and we're aware, in any moment, we can touch everything that's there. And because there's so much there, it changes, right? It changes. It's not this one, concrete flower, the flower is just the name.
So it's a beautiful way, I think, when to think about emptiness and, how it transforms to me, right? As this person who. that was the only way I could be was angry, or that I could only be suffering, that's not true. That's just the conditions that led me to be that. And then, when I started reading these books and meditating and becoming still, then I was changing and then people who are used to Maricela being this way. Some of the conditions, were like taken up and kept saying, you're not being yourself, right? because that self was this angry person. But that's just one aspect or self of who I am. And, we become different selves each time. when we see a child, we become childlike. When we're an adult, we become adult. So we're always changing in these, very, easy, simple, and then big ways. So for me, the, transformation in looking at my anger and actually seeing there's more, it led me to want to discover that more. So I took a year off. And I went to Plum Village in France to, to just really see, what else was under the surface of this Maricela that had been, that she was supposedly this, person. And then it just continued because the transformation continues as long as you're willing to. To stay with it and to keep looking at what's there.
[00:30:53] Hunter Clarke-Fields: I know sometimes, people tell me that, Oh, Hunter, like your voice is so calming and all these different things. And for me, sometimes I find that funny because my perception. For my historic perception of myself is that, I'm not terribly calming. that's, the reason I was drawn to these tools is because I was very, I was used to be, for 27 years was on a very much an emotional roller coaster. And so I think it's so interesting to think that this, that there are, there are these, all these calming elements. You were saying that, in your activism, that people were like, you're not angry enough and you were glad you didn't listen to them. Did you find you were still able to be, someone who could be active for justice and things like that, even without a lot of anger?
[00:31:52] Marisela Gomez: Yeah, absolutely. And, this is still something, I do, I'm still involved in a lot of activism. It's a majority of my time. and the way I am is very different in the work that I do in these spaces than the way I used to. and I think it's our responsibility as we transform to bring ourselves, to try, if we can, bring ourselves back into some of those spaces that sort of held it. a criteria as to how you should be.
There's still the image of the, justifiable angry, protester, the images that are often shown on the screen. and yet, it's not the only way for change to happen to this, ability to look inside and to figure out what else is there, who else am I, injustice work, especially that we don't act like the people who say that are doing evil and, harmful things. It's really important that we don't act in those oppressive ways. so we're hurt. And so we hurt others, right? hurt people. so a lot of us enact, not all, but many people do social justice work. We're very familiar with the suffering of different kinds of injustice, whatever the, power dynamic may be, race or class or, sexual orientation or nation of birth or language or, any engender.So often we're in struggles where, where we're fighting for those things that we were also, victim to, or we were, Also treated in some way in that same way. So we have this fire, and often we're still angry because we haven't had the time to transform that and heal those traumas or those oppressions that we experience in our body and in our minds.
So what I've learned and what I say often, especially in social justice spaces is we need to heal our stuff, in order to be the most effective in these places that we're doing this work. if not, we risk acting in similar ways. As quote the oppressor, meaning the behaviors of, separation and segregating and demeaning and, doing some of the, feeling some of the same energies hatred, toward people who we're fighting supposedly to stop hatred. but because we're so angry still, sometimes we, default into some of those same behaviors, not intentionally perhaps, but just because we're full of anger. And so this path has really opened up for me, the importance of healing. inside so that the way I speak to someone, whether they're speaking to me in a terrible way or an oppressive way, doesn't mean I need to speak back to them like that. I can still see their humanity. Even if they can't see me as a human being, it doesn't mean I need to not see them as a human being. I still need to see them as a human being because that's who they are. and then I get to wonder why they're acting that way. And hold that space for them.
It doesn't mean I condone their behavior and it doesn't mean I wouldn't reprimand it or tell, or not accept it. It just means I would do it from a space of understanding instead of a space of anger. It's very different way to be in the world with people. It's a nonviolent way to be, and it's a more peaceful way to be, and I think it's the way we want to be, not just with people who are causing harm, in a population level or, implicit bias or any small daily way, but with our family, our family's always doing, they're always doing stuff, makes us hurt, right? Not intentionally. And so how in that interaction with someone who's a loved one, where it's a parent or child or sibling or, a beloved, how do we, have the spaciousness and the peace inside ourselves to see why they might be causing that harm in that moment? Why did they say that thing that they did?
Why did they act in that way? that makes us hurt if they say they love us. So this practice, this inner transformation, it develops this peace and this, spaciousness to allow us to, to have the moment to see that, to see all of who they are. So even when they're acting in that way, we can still see the beautiful things about them. It doesn't diminish that. Yeah, right now they're acting in this way and then we're still seeing how lovely they are, because we have this beautiful practice. To take care of ourselves, to be present and to not take it personally. and to remember that, sometimes we act that way too.
[00:37:22] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Stay tuned for more Mindful Mama podcast right after this break.
[00:38:30] Hunter Clarke-Fields: I love that you like made that connection between how you're describing how to hold space and how to be curious, bring that like mindfulness attitude of curiosity and understanding to the sort of socialist justice circles. And you made that connection also to like our families, because as you were saying those things, I was thinking, yes, like this is also like what we talk about a lot here, like in our families, right? With our children is like having that space. To be able to see behaviors and different things with curiosity, with trying to understand, with that, greater perspective and awareness. And you talk about, in your, book, Healing Your Way Home, which you wrote with Valerie Brown and, Kaira Jewel Lingo, that this idea of having a home within ourselves.
I almost think of that if we think about that in terms of parenting and the language that people are using around parenting now is the idea of we know that the idea of a secure attachment for a child requires not that a parent necessarily sleep in a particular situation with that child or, wear them on their body or not use a stroller or whatever. That's not what matters, but it matters that the parent has a sense of security within themselves and then can offer that, that loving attunement to that child, right? And to me, that is Finding a home within ourselves. Like when I think about what you guys wrote, this idea of finding a home with ourselves, that is that basis of a secure attachment.
And I'm just wondering, like from your perspective, What does that mean? And how do people do this? How can people do this when their lives are so busy and maybe under resourced?
[00:40:28] Marisela Gomez: Yeah, I think you just summarized, the whole path of liberation into, because, the, transformation of ourselves is what we bring into the space, so any space, whether it's an adult or a child, and especially if it's a child that we're, in a close relationship with as a parent or a care provider, so finding that home, the stability of our inner selves, our inner world, is really important. is really what we're sharing with everyone around us. And again, especially with children, they take the, as people would say, they take the cue from us. From us adults and especially the people who are around them and are their, prime care, primary caregivers. if we're a person who has this kind of unstable energy for whatever reason, no judgment, just saying that's how we show up because we haven't taken care of ourselves, that inner healing. we are transmitting that energy to those around us. when you walk into a space, We know it, right? Like you walk into a room with people and you can even sometimes you immediately feel, Oh, I, can't be here. and, it's because of the energy that's in the space.
People are putting out certain energy. And then sometimes you walk into a space and you feel very comfortable. You feel very open. your body immediately relaxes. And so the energy in that space is one that allows that. This is the same thing we do when we're around, individuals and especially children, and they are little sponges, because they haven't hardened like us adults yet. where we would lock down and we're like now adults and now we're not vulnerable and et cetera. We know we don't have imaginary friends anymore. but the children, they still are blossoming and they still are having friends that are, we can't see as adults and, and they, just, they're little sponges and they take it all in.
And even when they're small enough to not have words yet, they're still taking it in. And their behavior is, really replicating the energy that is around them. And so when the child is calm, usually the people around them that they spend most of the time with, they're also calm. And, then the other way is true as well, is when as adults, we haven't taken good care of ourselves to transform the things that are hardships and, things that have made us suffer. unfortunately, it's a transmission that energy, is a transmission to those around us, to parents, to friends, and certainly to our little ones. you can even see it with animals, right? it's so clear with animals. The, way the little animals, especially not so much the cats, cause they're in their own world. So true. But the doggies, with doggies, they really, you can see up the, their, primary care provider in the doggies and the way they behave, their, friendliness, their, besides the breed, the type of breed of dog they are. But you, really can tell, a lot about the house the dog is in, by the way they behave. and so I'm not comparing a dog to a human. Clearly, I'm just saying that we really drop ourselves into this, into the body and hearts and minds of those around us. And I think with children, it's, It's it's just so much, Tai used to say that before a couple got married, that they should go to a retreat together and practice mindfulness together. And that's so wise, because that healing that happens in the practice together and seeing each other and loving each other. Not just for who we wanted them, want them to be, but who they really are. It would really help so much when couples actually, whatever, same sex or non same sex couples have children together, it would be such a different world, because we would have, as adults, we would have done the work to take care, good care of ourselves. So when we have the little ones around us, we're aware how they're imitating and taking who we are in.
[00:45:26] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Yeah, I agree. I think that would be optimal, that we could all do that. Unfortunately, it's not, and we get to parenting and we get to places where life is chaotic and busy and distracted. And, I guess that's what I try to help people is to carve out moments of stopping. that parents need to just help our, hearts and minds stop racing into the future and the next thing and the next thing and the next thing and the next thing and the achievement and the go and the go To just give ourselves moments because, for me, like a huge thing that drives me is Tich’s quote: “When you love someone, the best thing you can offer is your presence”. How can you love if you are not there? And I think that we're not there. And then so many people are to not be there by everything in the world.
And then you get to your beach vacation and you're like, then I will be there for my child and then I will be present. And then you can't, you get to that moment and then you can't because your brain has been trained day in and day out, always, to go, into the future. And to me, that's heartbreaking. And also all the pieces about our, reactivity, it, I don't know, I guess I, I feel like the importance of stopping. can't be, underestimated. What do you, how do you take care of yourself today, these days?
[00:47:20] Marisela Gomez: I would say it's a continuous journey, but I think the more accurate thing to say is it's a continuous struggle, because of just what you said is, we're not socialized, to stop and take care of ourselves. And certainly as female bodied people, especially in parenting roles, there's, certain expectations. but in non parenting roles, even as a non parent, I don't think society expects us to care about ourselves. It's really interesting, phenomena, right? because if we did care about ourselves, then we would, it would lead to us doing caring enough to notice, Oh, I need to stop right now. Or, I didn't get a good breakfast this morning. So just those small little things. And that's what I'm trying to do. That's how I try. is to, start the day with meditation, because that slows me down immediately, sets the pace. And then some kind of movement, whether it's Tai Chi or yoga or Qigong or walking, to physically get the energy moving. And there's a lot of breathing there too. And I try to take a break during the day, even if it's 10 minutes of some kind of movement with breath. And then I meditate in the evening as well, before I go to bed, and I find that to be really exceptional, the evening meditation, because in that evening meditation, it's like all the stuff of the day, it shows up, and then you realize, wow, I didn't even notice that in the midst of that, or I didn't even think about that in the midst of that.
I think it's an interesting process to actually let yourself, reflect on the day. And then at some point you have to stop it and then follow your breath and not keep moving your mind back and forth. I also, in the last, I think, couple of years, dance more. I find dancing, it moves a different part of the body. And also I think makes different connections. And just being in nature for me is a big way of taking care of myself. I find nature to be, my buddy. it just always reminds me I could be in a completely different head space and I walk outside for two minutes. And I'm a different person. It's all that stuff drops away. And it's like this, like we started talking about earlier, we change into someone else. There's like other things that show up, the importance of other things show up. so I find, nature to be, very wise in, always being present. It's almost like you always have something. That can bring you joy and that can bring you back to peace. If we can just remember, that just feeling the wind on the cheek or, seeing something green or blossoming or even a tree that doesn't have leaves, yeah, that, that moves you to a different way of being.
[00:50:53] Hunter Clarke-Fields: I encounter people, I encounter this perception that after we've been practicing meditation for a while, it's We're going to get, just get it all figured out. We're not going to struggle so much. We're not going to suffer so much. And I know from my perspective of now having been meditating almost like 18 years or something, that's not true. I still have to, I still sit and my mind goes crazy for a little while and all that, and it's not easy and it's still something that can be challenging. Would you say the same, Maricela? Yeah.
[00:51:34] Marisela Gomez: I remember earlier I said it's a struggle. Yeah. So I, and I said it intentionally because I think it's important, just like you said, for people. Especially people just starting, someone listening to this podcast and thinking, Oh, they've been meditating 20 years. There's no way I could do that. But no, it's, that's why they call it a practice is because we're always practicing. and I'm, I find myself in the same place is, there's a need I think acknowledge that what I say is this, especially when I'm mentoring people, I say in meditation is, how you just get up and brush your teeth and before you go to bed, you brush your teeth, you don't even think about it, you just do it. That's how we have to think about meditation, is, just like that. You brush your teeth, you don't even think about it, you just go sit on the cushion.
And this was a teaching I learned a very long time ago, which is, I think this was Ajahn Chah. Ajahn Chah was a Thai, a forest monk in a forest tradition from Thailand, very wise, no longer alive, elder, who's now an ancestor. He said, you don't think about it sometimes. You just go and do it. You just sit down. And actually after a while, your body just gets used to wanting to go and sit down in the morning or go and sit down at the night, before sleep. And sometimes you can only sit for five minutes. Because your mind's racing or there's a schedule, like that's real. And then sometimes you can sit for a little longer, training the mind and the body to get into this habit, right? Cause that's what the practice is. It's looking at our habits that we have formulated and deciding which ones we want to keep, right? Having the spaciousness to do And so what it is, training this mind and body and heart in new habits. And so you just go and you sit in the morning or you just go and sit at night or whatever your practice is, it doesn't have to be sitting meditation. It can be walking meditation. It can be Qigong, it can be whatever it is. It can be dance. It can be journaling, writing poetry, drawing, crafts. anything that gives us that spaciousness where we're back to the present moment with exactly what's in front of us and the mind is not spinning on the tasks ahead and the ones that happen, anything that brings us back to that present moment and begins to calm the body and the mind and brings us that spaciousness is, your way, is your door to finding that peace.
[00:54:29] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Maricela, thank you so much for coming on the Mindful Parenting podcast, the book co authored with Valerie Brown and Kaira Jewel Lingo is called Healing Our Way Home, Black Buddhist Teachings on Ancestors, Joy and Liberation. You can find it anywhere books are sold. Thank you for coming and sharing your time with us and, sharing your voice and your experience. It's really been a pleasure.
[00:54:59] Marisela Gomez: Thank you, hunter, for having me, and I've enjoyed the conversation as well
.
[00:55:08] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Hey, I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, of course, A, it's just share with a friend. Maybe there's someone you wanna share with that will make their. Give them a nice day to think about mindfulness and healing and peace, changing your energy. yeah, I, what I always say is what we practice grows stronger.
So good for you for taking the time to practice today. Water the seeds of peace and that energy in you. And I'm wishing you all the best, my friend. Thank you for listening. I wish you a week with more peace and ease and love and joy and, and it's not easy to be human. It's just hard. Sometimes it just seems relentlessly hard. And if you're having a time where it's feeling relentlessly hard, just know that you're not alone and that this will pass. Okay? You're not alone. We're, all, it's just not easy to be human. I think. My goodness. So I wish You watering those seeds of peace, watering those seeds of ease, all of that. I hope this helps and I will be back next week. Thank you so much for listening. Namaste.
[00:56:39] Mindful Mama Member: I'd say definitely do it. It's really helpful. It will change your relationship with your kids for the better. It will help you communicate better. And just, I'd say communicate better as a person, as a wife, as a spouse. It's been really a positive influence in our lives. So definitely do it. I'd say definitely do it. It's so worth it. The money really is inconsequential when you get so much benefit from being a better parent to your children and feeling like you're connecting more with them and not feeling like you're yelling all the time or you're like, why isn't things working? I would say definitely do it. It's so, worth it. It'll change you. No matter what age someone's child is, it's a great opportunity for personal growth and it's a great investment in someone's family. I'm very thankful I have this beautiful child. You can continue in your old habits that aren't working, or you can learn some new tools and gain some perspective to shift everything in your parenting.
[00:57:43] Hunter Clarke-Fields: Are you frustrated by parenting? Do you listen to the experts and try all the tips and strategies, but you're just not seeing the results that you want? Or are you lost as to where to start? Does it all seem so overwhelming with too much to learn? Are you yearning for community people who get it, who also don't want to threaten and punish to create cooperation?
Hi, I'm Hunter Clark Fields, and if you answered yes to any of these questions, I want you to seriously consider the Mindful Parenting membership. You'll be joining hundreds of members who have discovered the path of mindful parenting and now have confidence and clarity in their parenting. This isn't just another parenting class.
This is an opportunity to really discover your unique lasting relationship, not only with your children, but with yourself. It will translate into lasting connected relationships, not only with your children, but your partner too. Let me change your life. Go to mindfulparentingcourse.com to add your name to the wait list, so you will be the first to be notified when I open the membership for enrollment.
I look forward to seeing you on the inside: mindfulparentingcourse.com.
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