Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart is a pediatric psychologist, author, and parent coach, helping overwhelmed parents better understand their kids and strengthen family connections.
525: Misconceptions About ADHD Kids
Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart
Do you have an ADHD kid? Hunter Clarke-Fields speaks with Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart about ADHD, addressing common misconceptions, the nature of the disorder as a dysregulation issue, and the historical context of ADHD diagnoses. They discuss the cultural perceptions of ADHD, the impact of educational systems on children with ADHD, and effective parenting strategies to support neurodivergent children.
Ep 525- Ann-Louise Lockhart
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*This is an auto-generated transcript*
[00:00:00] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: My brain is lying to me right now. My brain is giving me information, or I'm believing something that's part of now my core belief that's actually not true.
[00:00:12] Hunter: You're listening to the Mindful Parenting Podcast, episode #525. And today we're talking about misconceptions about ADHD kids with Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart to kick off the “Different Brains, Amazing Kids” series.
Welcome to the Mindful Parenting Podcast. Here, it's about becoming a less irritable, more joyful parent. In Mindful Parenting, we know that you cannot give what you do not have, and when you have calm and peace within, then you can give it to your children. I'm your host, Hunter Clarke-Fields. I help smart, thoughtful parents stay calm so they can have strong, connected relationships with their children. I've been practicing mindfulness for over 25 years. I'm the creator of the Mindful Parenting course and teacher training, and I'm the author of the international bestseller “Raising Good Humans”, “Raising Good Humans Every Day,” and the “Raising Good Humans Guided Journal”. Yesterday I was on Zoom answering a question from a mom who had started a mindfulness practice and was struggling and I realized how much I love that. I love connecting with people. I love answering these questions and I want to do more of that here on the Mindful Parenting Podcast. So starting right now, you can You can leave me a voicemail with your mindful parenting questions. If you have a current parenting challenge, if you're frustrated with some behavior, if you want to know more about mindfulness and how to get started, you can leave me a voicemail with your question. I'm so excited about this. The URL is mindfulmamamentor.com/VM. That's MindfulMamaMentor.com/VM. If your question is picked, I'll let you know and it will become part of the Mindful Parenting Podcast. Leave your voicemail now, MindfulMamaMentor.com/VM.
Hello and welcome back to the Mindful Parenting Podcast, a brand new welcome to you. If you are brand new to this, this is an awesome episode to join into. This is the first in our “Different Brains, Amazing Kids” series, and we're going to be talking to Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart, a pediatric psychologist, author, and parent coach who helps overwhelmed parents better understand their kids and strengthen family connections. So, I'm so glad for you. If you have an ADHD kid, this is an awesome, awesome episode for you to join into the Mindful Parenting podcast on because we are going to talk about some common misconceptions, we're going to talk about how ADHD is a dysregulation issue, and even some history of ADHD. And we'll talk about the cultural perceptions of it and how education systems impact kids with ADHD and how we can parent these kids better, how we can be supporters and, and help them grow into, you know, kind, confident kids.
This is part of our “Different Brains, Amazing Kids” series. We're going to have a series of experts on different neurodivergences in kids. So if you've got a different kid, This is the episode for you and if you get something out of it, I just ask that you just tell a friend about it. Tell someone, text it to them, let them know, hey, this might be a good episode for you to listen to.
And before we dive in, I want to let you know that all the things that we talk about in this episode, I talk about in “Raising Good Humans” and “Raising Good Humans Every Day”, and both books are available now. If you don't have “Raising Good Humans Every Day” yet, this is the perfect bedside table book. If you don't have a lot of attention span, It's perfect, because it's 50 short chapters and I get to go beyond raising good humans to give you even more really in a bite sized manner. It's such a great bedside table book, so I hope you'll get yourself a copy of that because it really does support all the things we talk about in this episode. But you'll hear that in a second, so let's do that. Why don't we?
Okay, join me at the table as I talk to Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart.Thank you. Welcome to the Mindful Parenting podcast. I'm so glad you could come on. Thank you for having me. Yeah, I mean, I'm excited to talk to you. So many people struggle with kids with ADHD. They have a kid that is diagnosed with ADHD, then they discover, “oh, I'm diagnosed with ADHD”. Like, it's, it's really common so many people around me. I'm seeing that. What are some of the common misperceptions about A DHD that you see in your practice? Especially with working with kids. Yes.
[00:04:54] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: The one main common misperception I hear a lot. is someone says, Oh, I think your child has ADHD. He's like, no, they can't because they do good in school. They have good grades. And that is a common misperception that if you have ADHD, you must be failing in school, that you have a low IQ. And it's like, Hmm, they're not the same thing. You, it's common for individuals with ADHD to also have a learning challenge diagnosis like dyslexia, dysgraphia. But you can be a straight A student. And still have ADHD, and I think that is the biggest misperception.
[00:05:31] Hunter: Wait, wait, what's dysgraphia?
[00:05:33] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Oh, dysgraphia problems with writing, handwriting. Okay. So, difficulty, they either have significant pain or difficulty with legibility when they're writing. And then there's dyslexia, so like flipping letters, words, kind of mixing up letters.
And then dyscalculia, which is math, a math disability. So those are the three most common learning challenges. But there's also things like reading comprehension problems, so they're like reading a word problem and they don't get it. Or they're not computing because of their processing speed and working memory, so.
But that, you don't have to necessarily have that because you have ADHD. So that's a big, big one that I hear often. Okay.
[00:06:11] Hunter: So then ADHD, let's just get down to basics then. Yes. Like what, what is it that we're looking for? If it's not, we're not seeing, You know, doing poorly in school.
[00:06:21] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: So it's a dysregulation disorder.
That's the bottom line. So ADHD is a dysregulation disorder, and it's considered an executive functioning dysregulation disorder. So it's part of the brain in the prefrontal cortex, so it's behind your forehead, and it's the last part of the brain to grow and develop, and this is the part of the brain that helps you to execute functions.
So things like making decisions, controlling your impulses. Managing your emotions. Processing how quickly you process information. How well you remember things. Doing things in sequence, planning ahead having good judgment, monitoring your attitude. I mean, it's a lot of stuff. It's also where your personality is.
And so and attention, focus, concentration, flexibility, like those are all executive functions. So when you have ADHD, What's happening is that there's a dysregulation of one or many areas of executive functioning. So you might have a kid, which is like another misperception, that in terms of attention, Oh, you know, he doesn't have attention problems.
He can play video games for five hours. Well, that's also dysregulation though, because what else is your kid not doing when he's playing video games for five hours? Maybe he's not going to the bathroom or he forgetting he's forgetting to eat. Or not talking to his friends, or forgetting that he should take a break or has homework to do.
So, it's dysregulation. So, a kid might be very inattentive, which is the more common one that people think of when they think of ADHD, but they could also be very hyper focused, where they read for hours and hours, or play video games for hours, or they're scrolling on their device for hours, and they just, they lose time.
They forget that they're even doing whatever that is that they're doing. So ADHD at the very basic level is a dysregulation disorder. And so one or many of those areas of executive functioning. could be impacted by an underactive frontal lobe because the brain is not getting the message to, okay, hold your tongue, don't say that, you just rolled your eyes, don't make that decision, okay, hold back, think before you do that thing, like all of those things because they're going 100 miles per hour in a brain that just doesn't know where the brakes are.
[00:08:35] Hunter: It sounds like, it's like these are, you know, all the things you're describing is like growing up, right? These are all the things that we. develop as we grow up, like we develop the ability to have impulse control, right? You know, that's something I talk about with parents a lot, is like developing our own, you know, strengthening our impulse control and, you know, thinking about the big picture.
What do we need to do? How do we need to have, you know, how do we respond to others, the responsibilities we might have to others, all of these things. These sound like, and I'm wondering if You know, because now we see there's so many more kids diagnosed with ADHD. It's huge. It's an enormous number. I'm wondering if we just, you know, looked at kids like this before as immature kids who just weren't, who just needed some growing up to do.
Do you, I'm wondering how you see that, that increase in the numbers of ADHD kids and, and is it a problem with just the way we're looking at or talking about kids or maybe a way we talk about them? problem with the way we talked about them in the past?
[00:09:47] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Well, the thing about ADHD, it's been around since like 1901.
So we've known about it for a long time. It just has been conceptualized differently. It used to be seen as a moral deficit. And then it was seen as a hyperkinetic thing where they just couldn't stop moving. Then it was seen as an inattentive thing. And it wasn't until the 1970s that they realized adults could also have it.
So, so all of these things, it's been around for a while. It's just that prior generations weren't really educated on it. And so many of these kids, like the adults that I see today, now, they had it back then. It's just that nobody knew it. They're just like, Oh, he's just flunking, or she's just can't keep a friend, or, you know, they can't focus long enough to save their life, or man, they're juvie.
Like, It's been around and I see it with a lot of professionals that I meet with today that they didn't get a diagnosis until their 30s and 40s, although they always had it. So, I think the issue with this A higher diagnosis that we're seeing is because we're more aware. We're more aware of it. We can conceptualize it better.
And frankly, Gen Z is really good at putting those mental health issues out front for the boomers, the Gen Xers all of those other previous generations who didn't want to deal with their issues. It's kind of coming out to the forefront. COVID very much highlighted it because of all the students who were online schooling and realizing that, Oh my gosh, I can't do this.
And so yeah, it was a disaster because maybe they could focus better in school and then they got online and realized that, oh my gosh, I can't save and, you know, focus to save my life. So, so I do believe there has been an increase, but I also believe there's been more education around it, that people are more aware.
And I agree. I think that there are some things that we see like, well, that's just immaturity. Kids are immature. They're hyper and they say things without thinking and they do things. And, but the distinction between typical development for a child and adolescent and ADHD is when those behaviors cause significant impairment on their functioning.
When they are, when they, lots of kids have a hard time focusing and attending to things, but when you cannot focus at all to the point where it's impacting how you're learning, it's impacting your friendships and what you're remembering, that your parents tell you to do a sequence of things and you cannot remember it, you cannot hold on to that information.
That impairment is when we might be looking at a disorder. It's kind of like when you're looking at kids who are worriers. and then anxiety disorder. Well, yeah, lots of people worry, but then when it comes to it's significantly impacting their functioning because they can't go to school, they can't go out to social events.
That's when you're looking at more impairment. And so that's the difference between ADHD and just a typical kid.
[00:12:38] Hunter: That makes sense. And it's interesting, I think, to think about that this was something that was developed in sort of 1901 too when, when that's when we started all, you know, kids all going into school and sort of let's all sit down in a row and let's all learn this thing.
Whereas before kids might've spent a lot of time outside, might've been caring for livestock or whatever they're doing and all the different things they're doing. And it, it is like an impairment of the things that we prize as a culture, right? This ability to be organized, to have all your ducks in a row, to, to know what to do when to that executive functioning, to, to be able to give your attention to something that, you know, maybe a paper on a page, not like a out.
something out in nature or the real world. It's, it's I mean, not to, I'm not trying to belittle it in any way, shape, or form, but I'm like looking at it in the big picture saying, oh, okay, this is a, this is a, an impairment of something that is, happens to be very uniquely prized now. right now, whereas for most of human society, it was just fine if you didn't, weren't on time to everything.
[00:13:56] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: And a lot of the traits for ADHDers with the high energy, thinking outside the box go, go, go, and, and really think in different ways compared to other people, very creative, those are very amazing traits. They're just not praised in a school setting where you're sitting for six, seven, eight hours a day in a chair. And it's interesting because when I meet with students who go to non traditional type schools, so schools that where they're outdoors all day, or they're like Montessori schools or schools where there's lots of creativity, or they have a shortened school day and lots of activities and field trips, they do so much better. It's like their ADHD doesn't even exist.
[00:14:36] Hunter: Stay tuned for more Mindful Parenting podcasts right after this break.
[00:15:00] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: A lot of students are suffering in our system, not just the ADHD kids, but just because of our school system does not really move along with how kids think and how they grow and how they learn.
[00:15:12] Hunter: And there's less recess. Yes. Yeah. I know. It, it, it's really we really need to change that, I think. You know, it's, I, the listener knows I'm a founding board member of the first public charter Montessori school in the state of Delaware. And so I believe in that ability for kids to like get up and move around and change what they're doing and have that, some of that autonomy in what they're doing rather than.
I think. You know, and, and to be able to take that very powerful component of what are you interested in to magnify your learning, imagine that, but ADHD I know is different. So how ADHD is affecting executive functioning, which is interesting because when I was talking to, I was talking to Robert Sapolsky about executive function and, and the prefrontal cortex.
And he's talking about how. The idea that it doesn't develop until we're in our early 20s and why is that? It's because it needs life experience. We need life experience to be able to fully develop this part of our brain. So how does ADHD affect that executive functioning and how can parents kind of support kids as they're learning and developing these skills?
Because I imagine there's a fine line to walk between I'm going to help you, I'm going to kind of be your executive functioning, I'm going to make sure you're getting the things and doing this and all that, and I need to hand you the reins so you can practice this. Oh
[00:16:37] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: yeah. That's, that's the exhausting part about parenting, especially parenting a kid who's very neurodivergent in the way they think, because yes, executive functioning are skills, but the thing about typically neurotypical kids, when their brain is developing, their executive functioning is not developing like every other kid until mid 20s, maybe 30.
But the thing is that there's not any lagging in that development. They're developing as they are. So they can be flexible. They can learn to control their impulses. They're more amenable to instruction and they can kind of get it. Kids with ADHD, they don't just have an immature brain like every other kid.
They also have an underactive frontal lobe. It's not firing the way it should. So people are like, well, what do you mean it's underactive? Cause they're very hyper. Well, because their brain is not picking up on the message to do the thing that they need to do. So for example, this underactive brain, when they have to pay attention in math class, but they keep getting distracted by the guy who's blowing leaves outside, their brain doesn't give them the message.
Well, it's trying to give them the message. Okay, stop looking outside, pay attention to the teacher. But because their brain is underactive, it's not clicking. They're not getting that message. And so a lot of this teaching these skills, because they are a set of skills, it takes so much more repetition with an ADHD kid.
And so yes, the key for parents and teachers and and therapists, coaches, is to teach these kids these executive function skills, especially in the areas where they're lagging behind. So teaching them, for example, flexibility, flexibility is an executive function skill. These are ones where a lot of kids with ADHD can be very sticky.
They get very stuck. You said when Saturday came that I could play TV, video games on the TV, and then we can go to the park. Yes, I know, but the power is out and it's storming, so we cannot do either. But you said, so they can get very stuck on things, because they have great long term memory and horrible short term memory.
So they get very stuck. And then that's when you see these like toddler style temper tantrums, even for an older kid, because they get very stuck. They don't know how to adapt to changing situations. And so what parents need to do, teachers need to do is teach children how to be flexible. How to have an internal monologue.
Okay, I know I feel really upset because she said that I could do these things, but it's literally storming, so I can't go to the park. I'm gonna get electrocuted. Okay, bet. Let me do something different. Let me change course. I don't need to take this freeway anymore because it's busted, so I'm gonna take the exit and do something else.
But a lot of that requires a lot of internal monologuing. and redirection and practice over and over again, which is why it's so exhausting. But a lot of that is, yeah, you're teaching them these skills, but that's why people often will go to psychostimulants like Adderall, Vyvanse, Ritalin, because that helps to wake up the brain.
It helps to activate them. So that they can do the paying attention. They could be more adaptable. They can do all these things. It doesn't work for every kid and it is a quick fix. But the, the idea is we want to teach them the skills. Cause even if they're on medication, they still need to learn the skills.
The medication doesn't teach them the skills. It just helps their brain be more open to doing the thing they need to do.
[00:20:00] Hunter: That's really interesting. And so then I guess the teaching would involve, you know, the same way we all learn something where it's kind of like, first you do it for me, then you do it with me, and then you watch me do it, and then I do it on my own.
A lot of that.
[00:20:16] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Over and over
[00:20:17] Hunter: and over and over and over. So you're acknowledging the feelings, yeah, it's upsetting that we can't, you're upset that we can't go, you're disappointed that we can't do this. It's interesting, because I have a very Sticky, a kid who's very sticky about predicting things. I think it's.
It's not ADHD, it was something else, but she's very sticky about these things and it's like, yeah, I acknowledge those feelings. And then, yeah, so verbalizing these things out loud, verbalizing, it's disappointing to have this. This is why. What else can we do, right? And is that, I mean, cause that's what I've been told is like that when we're parenting ADHD kids, ADHD kids, that we are kind of doing the things we need to do neurotypical kids.
But we just have to be that much more patient because we have to do it that much more on the repetition again and again and again and again. Yes,
[00:21:11] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: yes, and no. So yes, you do have very similar things. The problem is that a lot of parents find that the, the parenting strategies, a lot of, you know, that they use for a lot of neurotypical kids who crash and burn with ADHD kids.
And the reason why is because of the dysregulation. Because once their brain, for example, gets sticky and they get stuck in this thought process, they are, now they're dysregulated. Now their thoughts are dysregulated because it's going a million miles an hour, their emotions are dysregulated. Their behavior is maybe they're kicking and they're screaming and they're hitting and they're spitting and they're yelling and they're stomping around.
And so no amount of validation and hearing them, they're not going to hear it because their brain is now in like explosion mode. They are now this volcanic eruption. And so they're actually talking to them in that way can actually set them off even more. So the key for a lot of these ADHD kids is to meet the emotion with emotion.
but more regulated calm emotion. That's where I talk to parents about the co regulation. And co regulation is basically you are lending your calm to your kid. So you're not doing a lot of talking with these kids because you're going to set them off. A lot, the key for a lot of them is preparing in advance because once they're in the moment, you have to just ride the wave.
So you either prepare them in advance, you meet their emotion with more rational, more calm emotion rather, and then you process it afterwards. So what I would do for a kid who's sticky, for example, if I know that we planned this video game going to the park, whatever it is. I might do something like yeah, so this weekend we're planning on, you're gonna get some screen time and then we're gonna go to the park, but I'm looking at the weather.
What if the weather isn't great and what if we lose power again because that's been happening a lot? Then what? Then what can we do? So you're preparing them for the worst case scenario, for example, and what are their options? Okay, well let's create a basket so that we can have things in case the power goes out and we can jimmy rig something that can be really fun.
Or if we can't go outside, what else can we do instead? And so you're basically planning in advance. Well, but what if the weather is great? Or what if you invited your friend over but then they can't make it at the last minute? For whatever reason, then what? So you're helping them come up, because that's problem solving, another executive function skill.
You're helping them create different scenarios like decision trees. So that they can make decisions that are helpful to them. They can look at all of the, I have options. I can have a big old tantrum about the situation that doesn't work out. That is an option. Or I could do these 10 other things. A lot of it is planning in advance.
If they react and they still don't get it, you ride it with them. Yes, I get that you're upset. Yes, that makes sense. You're upset. I totally get you're upset. You don't try to do too much talking and then after they've calmed down, then you bring in, I know that you were really upset about that. Remember we talked about just in case the power goes out or the weather's really bad.
Let's revisit that again. Now, what can we do and how can I help you through this? Because if you try to talk too much rational, logical thinking in the emotion, it's just not going to work because they're not going to hear you. They're not going to process it.
[00:24:19] Hunter: Your job in that stormy moment is to be the calm mountain that the waves are crashing against, right?
But yeah, that's, and
[00:24:31] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: yeah. But the key, right, this is how we break cycles, is the repair. Because many of us as parents, when we were kids, we didn't get the repair because our parents were always right and we were always wrong. And so the repair is when like, you know what? I know that I freaked out on you and I was screaming just as you were screaming and that was totally immature and irrational and I apologize for my behavior.
Can we reset? So you repair because you're going to mess up. You're not going to do perfect parenting and you should never aim to do that because that's just unrealistic.
[00:24:59] Hunter: Yeah, yeah. No, this is, this is great. Yeah, because this is what we talked about in Mindful Parenting is this idea of, yeah, let's regulate our emotions.
Let's model that regulation, right? And, and let's be that, be that calm when our kids need it. And sometimes we're not going to be able to do that. And then you, maybe you need to take a break. And that's also modeling something healthy too, right? Is it modeling? Yeah. Okay, so you, one of the things you talk about is girls versus boys here, right?
So what are the unique challenges that girls with ADHD face compared to boys? And you say they're underdiagnosed, right? Yes, girls are. So
[00:25:40] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: there are three different types of ADHD. There's ADHD inattentive type. ADHD, Hyperactive Impulsive Type, and ADHD Combined Type. So with ADHD inattentive type, that's what used to be called ADD, they got rid of that several cycles ago in our diagnostic manual, but ADHD inattentive type is what we often see typically in girls.
And this is the one that often gets missed because they fly under the radar and they're not disruptive, they don't cause behavioral issues, they don't get in trouble at school, they're just in their own la la land, they're just kind of checked out. And that's the squirreling. They're looking out the window, they're thinking about their thoughts, they're, they're noticing other things, but they're not noticing their environment, they're kind of oblivious to their environment.
So, this ADHD and attentive type can look like anxiety. Often, they can be mixed up for one another, they can be both, but ADHD and attentive type is where there's procrastination, there's avoidance of things that feel too hard or time intensive, so a lot of times they avoid things like reading and math because of that.
They lose things that they need, like a pencil for class or forgetting to turn in their homework. They're disorganized. Their area and their workspace and backpack and locker and where they sit in the car in their room and their closet are messy because they're very disorganized and they get overwhelmed easily by mess.
So that's typically what we see for the inattentive type. And these are kids that often will go to undiagnosed for a long, long time. The ADHD hyperactive impulsive type is more common in boys. And this is where they are like driven by a motor. They're on the go. They're constantly, it's like this Ferrari engine just moving, moving, moving with like Pinto brakes, like just so small.
They are running, they're on the go, they talk, they're like in the class, they're always blurting out answers, like their hand is always like halfway up, like me, me, me, and then you call on them and they don't even know the question you just asked. They're interrupting conversations, they speak out of turn.
They're just on the go. These kids, when I work with, I love working with ADHD kids, but hyperactive impulsive kids wear me out because they are just going a million miles an hour. And it's like, and you can see when they've checked out, like you're talking to them and then you can see when they've checked out.
And then they're just, or they interrupt, and that's why a lot of times they have problems with friendships because they're interrupting, they don't know how to take turns in a game, or when they're playing like a board game or something, they don't know how to take turns because they're always impulsively acting and they're always making noise.
Maybe they're humming, they're tapping their pencil, tapping their foot, getting up when they should be seated they're just on the go. And then the ADHD combined type are both together, the inattention and the hyperactive impulsive. Yeah. Yeah. Haha, that one is a tough one and so that's, those are the most common ones and so that's why the, the girls who are, have the inattention will often get missed for a very long time because it gets misinterpreted as something else or they just like, oh, they're, she's just a daydreamer, she's in her own world, she, oh, she missed the homework assignment even though I told her five times.
[00:28:51] Hunter: It's, I have a couple of questions to that, which is so interesting. I'm wondering then, yeah, how do you know when it's, you know, how do you deal with a kid who, how do you know when a kid is just disorganized and overwhelmed and a daydreamer and just is going through a phase and maybe and needs some help maybe with executive function things versus I need to take my kid to a psychologist.
I need to maybe get them on medication. And then, then also with the boys, I mean, with the girls too, with the ADHD, but when thinking about that hyperactive ADHD, I imagine that these kids get reprimanded. A lot, and it really probably does an incredible number on their self esteem. Absolutely. So, I guess I have two totally separate questions here, but those are the both of the things that occurred to me as you were speaking about that.
[00:29:43] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Yes, ADHD is one of those things, and I do not believe in over diagnosing or pathologizing behaviors for children, because as we talked about earlier, kids are immature. and kids are rational and that is how they're supposed to be. The, the thing is when it becomes impairing, when it significantly impacts the way they show up and function in their friendships and their families and their own personal life when they're by themselves and their schoolwork.
And so yes, a big part of it is to teach them the skills. But what I always say is that ADHD is a, a rule out diagnosis, which means that a lot of things look like ADHD. And so ADHD can look like anxiety depression can look like ADHD, trauma because it impacts the frontal lobe and the brain and so it will impact the way you process things and your memory and the way you focus.
So trauma can look like ADHD medical issues like pain or problems hearing, problems seeing. Any kinds of medical issues, low blood sugar, diabetes, those can look like ADHD because if you're focused on your pain, you're not focusing on what you need to look at. If you're it can make you irritable.
So then you're kind of more inflexible and disruptive. So there's a lot of diagnoses that look like ADHD. And so I always tell people that if there are things that are showing up that are impacting the way you're parenting your kid, or it's impacting the way that your kid is showing out. Usually when I see a kid that comes in and we're not sure if they have ADHD or not, a lot of what they're reporting is when these typical behaviors have actually impacted them in a major way.
I can't keep friends. I'm always losing friends. I I, I can't focus enough. I know the work, but I cannot focus enough. Or I'm always, I'm doing my homework and I'm forgetting to turn it in all the time. Or I'm missing important information in class. So it's, it's things that are really impacting and no matter how hard they try, they just can't get past that hump.
And so that's where if you find that it's impacting your child enough or their home life or their school life, their friendships, sometimes consulting with the pediatrician. And then getting a referral to a psychologist to get an evaluation could be helpful to see like, okay, let's rule out all the things that it could be, or maybe they just have poor executive functioning and don't have ADHD.
Because you can have executive function challenges and not have ADHD. So, because with ADHD, it's not just you have these symptoms, but they have to be present in two settings, at least two settings, like home and school, and they have to cause a significant impact on your functioning. And so, if you just like, you know, I'm just a little messy, and I'm somewhat inflexible, and I have problems with impulse control, well, that doesn't mean you have ADHD, that just means you need to work on those skills, like a lot of people, so then you work on those skills, and, and if you are able to be receptive to it, someone without ADHD would be more receptive, And they would be able to overcome it and work on it and not have as much of an issue because now they have those that skill set.
Someone with ADHD, it's harder for them to get it. They're like, oh, I know I'm supposed to do it. It's just so hard for me to start it. It's hard for me to initiate what I need to do. And it's like this, it's like they have this roadblock. It's there's something else that's in the way. So it makes it much harder for them.
[00:33:06] Hunter: Stay tuned for more Mindful Parenting podcasts right after this break.
[00:33:44] Hunter: I imagine that can be incredibly hard for parents and pediatricians and psychologists to parse out. I mean, I'm, I mean, if you asked me to explain that to somebody right now, and you just said it to me, I might not be able to do it because that's very, a very minute difference between like, stealing the feeling of having this roadblock versus I'm just distracted and unorganized.
[00:34:10] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: And that’s where education comes in. A big part of that for me is education, like teaching them this is what our frontal lobe does, this is what our brain as a whole does, this is what executive functioning is about, and this is what your brain is supposed to be able to do by the time you're mid twenties.
So it's not expected that you know how to do these things at 10, at 15, at 20 even. So, You know, it's really starting with education. And so when you're thinking about starting a task, task initiation, which is another executive function skill, how hard is it for you to start it? Do you just need a little motivation, or do you need a lot of motivation, or does it feel like it's a horrible task every time you have to start something?
So a lot of the, the evaluation for ADHD requires like observation as well as subjective questions and then objective questions. There are actually tests that are measured across standardized. groups of people where you can note, okay, this is what shows up and this is what's typical in this population.
So this is not ADHD. This is actually anxiety or this is definitely ADHD and attentive type. So people don't have to rely on their just Google knowledge or they can also see a professional who can look at this as I'm observing your kid. I've asked them these questions, I've spoken to the teachers, given them the assessments, given the parents the assessments, given the kids the assessment, and then we've done objective measures.
And so usually once it gets to that point, you can have a more definite diagnosis, or lack thereof, because you can, because those tests are meant to look at those minute differences. Because for some kids it's really obvious. And for other kids, you're just like, Oh, I can't tell because I've seen kids sometimes over time where we're like, yeah, this is definitely anxiety.
And then it's like, Oh my gosh, wait, it's actually ADHD. And so it can be really hard to tease out sometimes, especially if there's not significant impairment at the time that it's showing up.
[00:36:04] Hunter: Okay. Regardless of maybe how exactly how that sort of shakes out in the end, they're going through some stuff with their kids, their friends, right?
They may be having trouble having friendships. Because they may, you know, they may have trouble with emotional regulation, I imagine because prefrontal cortex really helps us with emotional regulation enormously. How can parents navigate some of the some of the emotional ups and downs that kids experience?
that are suffering in these ways are going through.
[00:36:37] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: I think a big part is always starting with education. Help your kid. What I find is that children and teenagers who are having a hard time, they need to know that they're not a freak of nature. That they're not broken, they don't need to be rescued and fixed.
Many times they just have to have insight and be informed about what's going on. I just had a session with a teenager this week, someone I've been seeing for quite some time off and on and straight A student. She's amazing, does really well, but her ADHD really prevents her from having really good friendships.
And and it really impacts her relationships in general. That's the major way that it impacts her. And a lot of her thought process is this, what is wrong with me? Why can't I ever fit in? Why don't people reach out to me? What is wrong with me? And so I think when I was able to educate her on, hey, remember, your ADHD prevents you from regulating those thoughts.
So when you have a thought, it will run wild. You will start to have this thought, which affects your mood, because she was talking about moodiness. It's affecting your ability to engage with people because now you feel like a loser, so then you withdraw from other people, and that's why you start to spiral.
That's that dysregulation piece, remember that. Oh yeah, that's right, so I'm moody because of my thoughts. Right, because thoughts are the foundation of everything else. It will trigger that moodiness because you're feeling different, you're feeling left out. So if you can remember that, you're like, okay, this person didn't call me back right away, that's what I'm seeing on the surface.
What I'm telling myself is that no one likes me. I'm a reject, that I'll never have friends, that I'll never be different. Those are very different things and you're hurting yourself by doing that. So I think a big part of it, really empowering our kids and our teenagers with that information so that they can better understand their brain, that they can feel like they, oh yeah, this is what my brain, my brain is lying to me right now.
My brain is giving me information or I'm believing something that's part of now my core belief that's actually not true. I'm not unlovable. I'm unlovable. I'm not unlikable. That's the core belief of adopted based on things I've seen. So I think that education is really important in helping them better understand their brain.
So whether they have ADHD or anxiety or depression or a learning challenge, whatever it is, that they should know that, that they're not broken. It's just, this is the way their brain is wired. And the good news is that it can learn to behave differently when you give it the skills that it needs. And so that's the good news.
So I always, I think that for most things, it starts with the education and really helping. that individual understand who they are so that they understand their brain, and they're, they're be less likely to get stuck in that spiral of messy feelings and thoughts when they understand themselves better.
And the parent will understand them better too.
[00:39:23] Hunter: Yeah. This is what you're, what you're talking about for me is screams mindfulness. You know, it's like, hello, see those thoughts, see them for what they are. These are words. that are happening in my head. Are they real? I don't know. You know, are they true? I'm not necessarily.
And it, this sounds like an amazing conversation to happen between you, you know, a psychologist and your client for a parent or a kid who may not have a relationship with a psychologist or a therapist, because it's pretty hard to find them these days. I tell you, if you want to find someone for your Kids, it can be really hard and can be hard for them to make that relationship.
A lot of people can't afford that. What do you suggest for parents to become that kind of supporter or advocate or, you know, guide for their kids to be able to step into that role? I imagine there's a shift that might happen for parents where when they were struggling with it, they might have been like, they, you know, a lot of there might have been a lot of critical thoughts coming, a lot of censure, a lot of correction, a lot of this, and then there might, seems like there might be a shift.
Yes. From that kind of critical role to more of a supporter that needs to happen for parents.
[00:40:44] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Yeah, there is a known thing that parents with ADHD kids Correct more than than they encourage. And many kids with ADHD get so many negative messaging, which is why it impacts them, and why many times they develop depression and anxiety because of that.
And so I think that a big thing is for the parents, because yes, it is hard to find a psychologist, and Afford a lot of the services, but there's so much more free information than there ever has been, and it is widely available from looking at blogs, listening to podcasts, looking at articles from reputable sources and individuals, and, or Instagram accounts that have that information.
So there's a lot, there's a plethora of information, and what I would encourage parents to do is to Seek out some of those sources, people that you trust, that you like, so you don't, you don't need to bombard yourself with information, but getting the basics of it, and then educating yourself, and then educating your child.
Because again, I think that it goes really, it can go really far when you can let your kid know that, hey, I did not fully understand that being organized isn't easy for you. Or I didn't fully understand what ADHD even meant and how it impacts you. And so I do a lot of nagging and yelling and overcorrecting and I'm sorry for that.
That's the repair. And I want to be more intentional and mindful about the way I parent you because I know it's hard for you because it's hard for me too because I don't get it because I'm a very neat person so I don't understand why you're messy like whatever it is like I don't get it but I'm seeking to understand and I want to understand you and I want to support you and these are some of the ways that we can do it.
And so, and showing them like these are the different executive function skills, like checklist it. Like, okay, which ones do you feel like you struggle with the most? How can I support you in this? Here are some interventions or strategies for each one that I've learned about. Let's start with organization.
Let's start with decision making. Let's start with impulse control, whatever it is, and let's focus on it and build that up. And I tell teachers do the same thing. Like a lot of the, the evidence in the research shows that teachers should really be focusing on building executive function skills in the first few weeks of school, rather than teaching the stuff that needs to be taught.
Because when kids learn that they can be flexible, or when they can learn to regulate their emotions, When they are then learning something that's frustrating or hard. or feels impossible, if they know how to regulate their emotions or how to advocate for themselves, you'll find that it'll be an easier classroom to be in and for them to learn better because now they have the executive function skill.
But they can't learn that if they've never learned it. And so I think a lot of where parents and teachers can start is by just educating yourself on the very basics of what ADHD is, how it shows up, The strengths, because we don't want to look at all the weaknesses, but what are some strengths about these kids with ADHD?
Because they're very creative, they think outside the box, they have lots of energy, they're really fun to be around. And so helping them understand, like these are, there's some great things about them. It's not all doom and gloom. And these skills can get better with time because they're building the skills.
[00:43:49] Hunter: I think that's so hopeful. Imagine if, and every school teachers started the year teaching kids about like, hey, we all get, feel stressed. This is what, you know, this is so hard. This is what we can do. This is, this is the fight, flight, or freeze response that happens in our bodies. This is what we can do to calm it down.
This is what I can do. It's what you can do. Let's all try this longer exhales together. Imagine if we all did that. I think we might be get to that day Someday. I think we're moving towards it. Yeah. But who knows? I mean, that would be amazing. This is so awesome to talk to you. You have such a plethora of knowledge I didn't even get to ask.
Half the questions I want to ask, but I wanted to ask you, you know, is there anything that we miss that, you know, the listener, maybe a parent who's struggling with a kid who's really disorganized or hyperactive or daydreamer is there anything that you want to say to that parent that you'd like to add?
[00:44:46] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Yeah, I, I want to encourage parents to be more gentle on themselves, more compassionate, because parenting, first of all, is a lot of work, it's hard, and then when you have a kid with ADHD, because their executive function skills in their brain is, are tapped out, they're tapping into yours. So if you yourself have ADHD, undiagnosed or whether, whatever, or your executive functioning is being taxed because of all this stuff, it's, it is harder.
So I want parents understand that it's hard because it is, but they can also then take the time to say, you know what, let me, Take a step back and know that this part is hard. My kid is not being intentionally defiant. They are having a hard time. So how can I assist them and come alongside them and be the frontal lobe along with them?
I had developed a course exactly that said, stop being the frontal lobe for the entire family for that exact reason, because parents are doing that. And that's, you know, you, what you can do is you can start to give them the skill. I know that you're having a hard time cleaning your room. So one of the things that I've learned is body doubling, which means being with you while you do it.
So either assisting you or just being present. Let's try it. Let's set a timer. 15 minutes and then we're going to do it. You pick up the dirty clothes. I'll pick up the clean clothes, whatever it is. Like, so being able to know that you can be gentle on yourself and then knowing that your kid is not intentionally trying to make you miserable.
The fact is that they are often miserable, which is why they're having a hard time and they're giving you a hard time. So I think we have to keep. Keep that in mind, because I think parents then start to get very stressed out by parenting because they think their kid has these ill intentions when they're really doing their best to just like you are.
[00:46:27] Hunter: I think that's such a perfect note to end on. Dr. Anne Louise Lockhart, thank you so much for coming on the Mindful Parenting Podcast. It's been a pleasure. Thanks for having me. Thank you for all you do.
[00:46:39] Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart: Yes. Yes. Thank you for the work that you do as well. And thanks for the invitation.
[00:46:47] Hunter: Thank you so much for listening. This is such a powerful episode. I mean, I hope that if you've got an ADHD kid, this has helped you. And if it has, please just text a friend about it today and tell someone who could use it. And if you want to go further and do more, I would love a review on Apple Podcasts. And that's super easy to do. You just well, if you're listening on your phone, you're there's a place where you can click right now on your phone to Go leave review. It's really easy. So that really helps the show a lot.
And like I said, this is part of the, this is the first in the “Different Brains, Amazing Kids” series. So be subscribed, be back here on Tuesday for the next one. We'll be talking to more experts about neurodivergent kids and how to be the best parent for them that we can be. But if you can't wait for that and you want more on ADHD kids, I recommend episode #453, “How to Decrease Drama with Your ADHD Teen” with Anne Coleman. And episode #409,
“How Parents of ADHD Kids Can Thrive” with Dr. Mark Bertin. And episode #393, “Helping ADHD with Nutrition” with Dana Kay.
Thank you so much for being here and listening. Like I said, we'll be back next week and I'm wishing you a great week. I would hope you have some ease and relaxation and a break. Maybe read a good book too. You do something that's not parenting related at all and that will make you a better parent just by helping you let go and have some downtime for a little while. Do it: you got this. You can do it. I'll be doing it too. I'll be practicing those good things to take care of myself because That's what we need.
That's what we need to do. So thank you for being here. Thank you for listening and I'll be back next week. Namaste.
[00:48:45] Mindful Mama Member: I'd say definitely do it. It's really helpful. It will change your relationship with your kids for the better. It will help you communicate better and just I'd say communicate better as a person, as a wife, as a spouse. It's been really a positive influence in our lives. So definitely do it. I'd say definitely do it. It's so worth it. The money really is inconsequential when you get so much benefit from being a better parent to your children and feeling like you're connecting more with them and not feeling like you're yelling all the time or you're like, why isn't things working? I would say definitely do it. It's so, so worth it. It'll change you. No matter what age someone's child is, it's a great opportunity for personal growth and it's great investment when someone's there. You can continue in your old habits that aren't working, or you can learn some new tools and gain some perspective to shift everything in your parenting.
[00:49:49] Hunter: Are you frustrated by parenting? Do you listen to the experts and try all the tips and strategies, but you're just not seeing the results that you want? Or are you lost as to where to start? Does it all seem so overwhelming with too much to learn? Are you yearning for community people who get it, who also don't want to threaten and punish to create cooperation?
Hi, I'm Hunter Clarke-Fields, and if you answered yes to any of these questions, I want you to seriously consider the Mindful Parenting membership. You will be joining hundreds of members who have discovered the path of mindful parenting and now have confidence and clarity in their parenting. This isn't just another parenting class. This is an opportunity to really discover your unique, lasting relationship, not only with your children, but with yourself. It will translate into lasting, connected relationships, not only with your children, but your partner too. Let me change your life. Go to MindfulParentingCourse.com to add your name to the wait list so you will be the first to be notified when I open the membership for enrollment. I look forward to seeing you on the inside. MindfulParentingCourse.com.
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