Chinyelu Kunz is the founder of We Nurture Podcast. She has worked as a Waldorf early childhood educator for over 25 years. Chinyelu completed her Waldorf Early Childhood teacher training and she also holds a Masters in Architecture as well as a Bachelors in Interior Architecture. Her mission is to make easily accessible knowledge, advice and guidance on parenting and caregiving in the early years through the lens of Waldorf Education. She is the proud mother of 3 Waldorf graduates.
547: Rhythm & Emotional Regulation at Home
Chinyelu Kunz
In this conversation, Hunter Clarke-Fields and Chinyelu Kunz explore the significance of rhythm in parenting, discussing how it fosters stability and flexibility in children. They delve into the practical implementation of daily rhythms, the holistic approach of Waldorf education, and the challenges of navigating technology and screen time in modern parenting. Chinyelu emphasizes the importance of empowering parents to trust their instincts and create nurturing environments for their children.
Ep 547- Kunz
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*This is an auto-generated transcript*
Chinyelu Kunz (00:00)
with this in-breath and out-breath in the day, it makes all the difference. The children are less overwhelmed, not dysregulated. Not to say that dysregulation doesn't happen, but boy, does it calm that down.
Hunter (00:19)
You're listening to the Mindful Mama Podcast, episode number 547. Today we're talking about rhythm and emotional regulation at home with Chinulu Khuns.
Hunter (00:32)
Welcome to the Mindful Mama Podcast. Here it's about becoming a less irritable, more joyful parent. At Mindful Mama, we know that you cannot give what you do not have. And when you have calm and peace within, then you can give it to your children. I'm your host, Hunter Clarke-Fields. I help smart, thoughtful parents stay calm so they can have strong, connected relationships with their children. I've been practicing mindfulness for over 25 years. I'm the creator of the Mindful Parenting Course and Teacher Training, and I'm the author of the international bestseller, “Raising Good Humans”, “Raising Good Humans Every Day”, and the “Raising Good Humans Guided Journal”.
Hey, welcome, welcome. So glad you are here. Yes, emotional regulation at home. That is what we need and we're going to talk about it and how it is so helpful to get it with rhythm, rhythm. So today I'm talking to Chinyelu Kunz, the founder of the We Nurture Podcast. She has worked as a Waldorf early childhood educator for over 25 years and is the author of “The Little Book of Parenting: How to Nurture your Child to Their Full Potential”. And we're going to be talking about rhythm and how it fosters stability and flexibility. We'll talk about how to implement rhythm practically. We'll talk a little bit about Waldorf education and the challenges of navigating technology and screen time. We're going to talk about, you know, trusting your instincts and creating a nurturing environment for your kiddos and thinking about creating that rhythm that supports you and your kids' stability. So, good. So join me at the table as I talk to Chinyelu.
Well, Chinnyalu, thank you so much for coming on the Mindful Mama Podcast.
Chinyelu Kunz
Thank you, Hunter. Thank you so much for having me on the Mindful Mama podcast. I'm so happy to be here.
Hunter (03:08)
Good. Well, I'm excited to talk to you. I had a great time talking to you on your podcast and I'm enjoying your little book of parenting. It's so sweet. And you write about something that I wanted to kind of focus in on, on this conversation a little bit, which is you write about a thing that I have found this to be true also in my experience that provides more harmony in general in the family and less struggle with transitions, which is like, this is where I'm sure you get all your questions and I get so many questions and that is rhythm, right? So why is rhythm and routine so important for children's development and their stability kind of day to day?
Chinyelu Kunz
Yeah, very good question. I'm so always so happy to talk about rhythm. I've been at times calling myself the rhythm lady because I'm all about rhythm. Rhythm is what saved me in parenting, what made parenting for me a very joyful, literally very joyful experience as I parented my three children. And so I think a lot of parents know, but it's always wonderful to just kind of keep repeating this message that rhythm gives to a child, especially thinking of young children, a sense of stability and a sense of safety. And as children grow, rhythm provides that beautiful structure that organizes the day so that the day can flow well each day. I have found rhythm to be something that provides parents a sense of predictability also. And in terms of planning ahead for the day, they know what to expect. And that lessens mental fatigue, decision fatigue. So rhythm is something that just supports everyone, everyone in the family. Yeah.
Hunter (05:12)
I couldn't agree more: daughter was a highly sensitive kid and we needed everything we could get to kind of help her be, not become explosive on a day-to-day basis. And rhythm was a huge part of that. We had for a long time, we don't have it anymore now that my kids are now 18 and 15, a weekly meal rhythm. And it wasn't a rhythm where it was like, Monday- Sunday was vegetarian. Monday was rice and we would have something good with rice. Tuesday was soup and Wednesday was noodles and Friday was pizza. Right? Like, or it was just like, they knew what to expect. What night is it? And they would actually kind of, you know, make their week, you know, they would, they would kind of mark the time in their week by was it pizza night or was it pasta night yet? Is that what you're talking about when you're talking about rhythm?
Chinyelu Kunz (07:07)
Yeah, that's one area of it, planning meals rhythmically, dinners rhythmically. And that is something also another area within rhythm within our day where we can bring in this consistency, predictability and also for parents, like when I did that, when my children were young, my goodness, it was like such a blessing. I knew ahead of time, on certain days I could prepare ahead of time. When I went grocery shopping- you're at the store, there was a focus, I had my list, I knew what I was going to make. And that of course just really supports someone in just apparent in this situation in being more intentional about what they're doing and how the day's gonna look in this particular instance, thinking about meals, what they're going to prepare, and bringing balance into the meals. I think it helps one to less likely run to a fast food location and get food because of not knowing what you want to make and you're exhausted. And so, yeah, that's one aspect, like one aspect of rhythm, yes.
Hunter:
And you write in your book that, well, I do have to say yes, like it was so easy. Like I knew I would just put on a pot of rice and I'd be like, okay, let me figure out something to go with this. I'm not a big, you know, detailed planner, but it was very, it made it easier. But you write in your book that it helps kids learn to be more flexible and gain confidence because they know what to expect of them. It's interesting that sometimes we resist; I think things that are rhythmic because it feels rigid to us, but it actually helps kids to be more flexible. Talk to me about that and maybe some other ideas for rhythm.
Chinyelu Kunz (09:07)
Yes, yeah. Well, I'll talk about specifically maybe a little bit giving example of my time in the classroom. Because I think, when we see Rhythm working in a classroom with 14 children, two, four, five years old, then we really see, like, I really got to see the impact of that and the benefits of that in a very big way. Now, I saw it also with my three children, but with 14 children, one really gets to see that play out. And so, yeah, I think, you know, like for the children in the classroom, I cooked their lunches and they had snacks that we made right there. So they never brought in, they didn't have to bring in any foods. And the, yeah, the, the lunches and the snacks both were served rhythmically. Monday, they knew what to expect. Tuesday, they, you know, and so on and so forth. And then it's something that needed to be changed slightly because maybe it wasn't at the grocery store, because I did all the shopping too, then the children, I could supplement it or not supplement it, but exchange it for something else. And they were like so, so flexible because then I could say, this is what happened. But I mean, that rarely happened, but they were also more flexible in terms of trying new foods. Cause I always tried to like, introduce a new food like as a side, not as the main dish, which I often recommend to parents. If you want to try something new, try it as a side, not as a main, and not as part of the main dish when you're serving meals rhythmically, because then children are more likely to try it out and more likely to be more flexible about that.
And just thinking of the flexibility within the rhythm, like when children know what to expect and they can depend on it. I think some parents have the feeling that rhythm needs to be very rigid, which it doesn't, and that if something goes awry, then their child's going to lose it, but they don't. Because the way that rhythm flows from one activity to another with this breathing quality I always talk about that is in us, in our breathing, is in nature all around us, is in breath, out breath, then we can always come back to rhythm again. And that is where children can gain resilience and be more flexible. So long as we return to it. And if we are somehow those, you know, have to get out of it because of whatever happens, we return to it, yes.
Hunter (11:25)
Yeah, I had this hope that my kid would be very flexible and I could just like take her to a folk festival and just like have her nap wherever she fell asleep. And that really, really did not work for me. know, she really needed more structure and rhythm than that. And yeah, it's kind of interesting. It's kind of the opposite of the way we think that some rhythm is actually gonna help them be more flexible. What are other ways that we parents of young kids can have rhythm in their days. you think about having a similar rhythm to sort of like, guess, the daily flow, that kind of thing. You talk about nighttime and we talk about nighttime routines. People want like a nice routine for that, but maybe during the day as well. Yeah.
Chinyelu Kunz:
So where I always start, Hunter, with parents and I'm guiding parents right now in a new course that just came out in January called Home Rhythms Made Simple to help parents plan the rhythm, understand rhythm, and bring those qualities to rhythm that helps make rhythm work in their home. And it's so interesting, I often say as as a concept, as rhythm is, it is not easy to implement, especially if you're still struggling with understanding, at least through the lens of Waldorf, what this whole idea is of in-breath and out-breath and the flow of activities. So I always recommend to parents when it comes to rhythm to start with the four anchors in the day. And those would be meal times and bedtimes and time for play, independent play, and time outside in nature. So I start with getting that down on paper and the timeframe that that happens and then staying consistent with that.
And then around the four anchors, that's when other things can happen.in such a way that the child isn't thrown off completely and becomes either overwhelmed or dysregulated or confused, you know, all of that. So that's why I always tell parents to start. Start with the four anchors. So that's where I'm guiding this first cohort, so to speak, in this new course that just opened up in January. that I'm, yeah, I'm excited about it because it gets down to very granular about rhythm and how to create rhythm and how to sustain it and then where it needs to change and where it might need to have more flexibility and not to be afraid of change within the rhythm. Because that's one thing we know that's a constant in life. There'll always be change so we can prepare ourselves within the rhythm that we create for that.
Hunter (14:10)
Stay tuned for more Mindful Mama podcasts right after this break.
Hunter (16:19)
Yeah, you mentioned being a Waldorf teacher for many years. Some people in the listening audience are familiar with that. Some people aren't. Waldorf emphasizes this holistic approach to learning, integrating academics, arts, and practical skills. I know that there can be a pink-like, womb-like room for younger ages is what I've heard. And it's interesting, you cooked and shopped for all the meals. Can you walk us through how this philosophy kind of would play out in a typical day?
Chinyelu Kunz:
Rhythm is the backbone and especially when thinking of early childhood, but even into the grades. So in my classroom, I can kind of talk about what a typical day was like there. So the children would arrive and then getting out of their cars, coming into the classroom, put on their slippers, and then they'd come in to play. There was also the option of helping to chop vegetables or fruit or make bread for that we would have at snack time. And then they'd play, and then after play it was cleaning time to clean up. And then after that it was circle or story that I would do. And then snack time. And then after snack they'd help to clear the table and then they'd head outside to play outside for at least an hour.
Now on those very frigid, cold days, then we had to adjust so that everyone could be safe. On the warmer days, they could be outside up to two hours playing, which they just absolutely loved. And then back in for those who stayed for lunch, they'd come in, get ready for lunch and use the bathroom, come to the lunch table, and then it was rest time. But having said that, I need to also add, like I just kind of mentioned a bit ago about the in-breath and the out-breath. just what our bodies do as we breathe, you know, we breathe in, we breathe out, we breathe in, we breathe out. And this balance between in-breath and out-breath is what really supports the body and being in that, the nervous system being in that parasympathetic state. And so the flow of the activities, the flow of the activities during the day take that supremely into consideration. Like when I map out my day, I'm like sitting in the car coming to school, that's an in-breath. So when they get out, they need to move so that playtime is an out-breath. And then they clean up and then there's story time.
And that story time that is an in-breath, because it's a more focused time. And then they're going to use the bathroom, that's more of an out-breath, busy-ness, know, some of them diaper changes and, you know, so on and so forth. So when there's balance with this in-breath and out-breath in the day, it makes all the difference. The children are less overwhelmed, not dysregulated, not to say that dysregulation doesn't happen, but boy, does calm that down. And then we see the same thing happening in the grades. I was not a grades teacher, but three children who went through Waldorf right from practically birth all the way through to 12th grade, you know, where they, again, there's that car ride in the school, whether they're driving at, you know, later age or being driven by the parent. And then they have movement in the morning. Sometimes the teacher will have them running. Sometimes they'll have other movement exercises that they're doing to kind of wake up their body and be in their body, which is what we, you know, what the desire is before they sit down for main lesson, which is a more inward, that's an in-breath focus time. And then there's a break where they have a break to eat snack, talk to each other, socialize. There's more of that out-breath. So I won't go through the whole day, but I think you kind of get the idea of how that, the rhythm taking into, know, resting really being formed out of this in-breath, out-breath balancing is the backbone of creating the day, shaping the day.
Hunter (21:00)
That makes a lot of sense. I wish that we would, more schools would consider yours to the whole body like that. Yeah, my kids were in, I'm a big proponent of Montessori education and there's a lot of like choice about when you're moving and things like that and just kind of taking in the whole body and moving. think that's so, so important. That's so cool that they helped make their own bread. I thought it was amazing when my daughter was two and she helped make muffins just one day. But every day making bread, that's a lot. Well, they did it like once a week. would make, the children made bread. They would have loved to have made it more. And if there was a special occasion, we would bet they made bread, you know, once a day, at once a week. And that bread day was just, yeah, really, really wonderful.
That's so cool. One of the things that I know about Waldorf education and many people know is the delayed formal reading instruction until around the age of seven. And this of course runs counter to a lot of mainstream educational thinking. I know that my own daughter was a really precocious reader and it might've driven her crazy because she was in chapter books at four and a half. So she was really reading. So what is the reasoning behind it this and do you know of any research that talks about its effectiveness?
Chinyelu Kunz (22:23)
Well, I think, you know, one can find research coming out of Finland, probably even Denmark, about delaying reading until age seven. I find it interesting that the word delaying is used as opposed to what we kind of talk about in wall of education, the developmental appropriateness of when a child should be reading. Now, having said that, if a child reads earlier, there's no issue of course with that whatsoever. Like one of my daughters, one of her friends was reading in kindergarten all on her own. She just started reading and some children, you know, they'll, it'll take longer. But a couple of the reasons why that reading is left until really more like second grade, because in first grade they're learning letters. They're learning the alphabet.
And they're learning it in such a beautiful, beautiful way through stories. And so that this kind of way of learning that holistic approach is coming not only from the head perspective, the intellect, but also through the arts and also through movement. There will often be movement. Maybe they're playing out in movement the letters. Like “B” could be for the bear who bounded outside in the garden because he saw buzzing “B”, you know, they connect it and the teacher really enunciates and then it forms like a picture for them. It's not just that's “B”. Everybody say “B” or other words that begin with “B”. It's, my children just all really enjoyed learning, you know, that as a precursor learning to read, learning the letters in that way, and drawing it out in their main lesson books with these crayons and bright colors, and it's beautiful. so, one of the reasons why is that it's, in terms of thinking, know, developmentally, not all children are ready to read early. And yet something happens, you know, within the body when the child turns seven, their brain is, know, cognitively they're more ready, neurologically they're more ready. The brain is now really more ready for taking on academics. And that is something that the education is really focused on, teaching children to their, to the developmental phases.
So Waldorf distinctly has unlike I think any other education, this focus on the three seven-year periods in childhood, birth to seven, seven to fourteen, and fourteen to twenty-one. In those phases, cognitively, neurologically, you know, the brain is taking these leaps at these seven-year marks. It's not like a leap overnight, of course, but it's developing and then these leaps happen at these seven year marks. In a Waldorf education, the goal is to make reading something joyful and bring it in such a way so that children want to learn to be love learning as opposed to being feeling like pressure or stress around it. And not to say like it eliminates all stress because not all children already write at seven. One of my children didn't learn to read until she was in the summer of fourth grade. It took her quite a while, but we knew in conversation with the teacher that everything and then just seeing her, we read a lot right from early on and we could see that everything else was developing normally. There was nothing to be alarmed about. And so my husband and I thought, “Let's give her the time that she needs”.
And I'm so glad that we did. We didn't put the stress or pressure on her. And then I would think it was like the summer of fifth grade or so. I kid you not, she was reading 13 books a week, novels a week. And when it clicked, it clicked. And that was one of the things that we found so beautiful about the education that she had time, there was no pressure. She didn't lose any self-confidence over that experience of like, should be reading now, you must be reading now, what's going on, we're gonna send you here for extracurricular remedial. And her confidence stayed so strong. That's the part that I experienced myself. that's another part that I see that parents, the parents value about the education, those that choose it. so children in the early years, like as early as I get them, I did, I should say, when I was in the classroom, they are learning the precursors to reading. They're hearing oral stories. They are in their play telling stories themselves and that's allowing their ability through the storytelling to recognize letters and words and comprehension is strengthened. And so I could go on and on, but just to give that as an example.
Hunter (29:05.87)
I've heard rumors that in Silicon Valley that a lot of the big tech people have kind of embraced some Waldorf school, you know, and I know that Waldorf education has these elements of connection to nature and storytelling and play. What does the parents and teachers in the Waldorf community now do about the presence of screens and online learning and phones and things like that. What the heck happened during the pandemic? I have no idea. Like if you couldn't be able to do that, it'd be a remote learning. So what is the circumstance on all the technology at this point?
Chinyelu Kunz:
Yeah, COVID did bring on some changes, but I'll just back up a little bit. I think from conversations, the many conversations I had with a number of parents when I was in the classroom is that they felt that Waldorf was a complete no to technology and to screens. And what I tried to help parents realize is that it's not about a complete no. What it is about is that for every season, there's a time for what needs to happen or what can happen. And so if we look at it in that way, so this birth to seven season is a season where screens do not help a child develop developmentally. And I have seen over the number of years I was in the classroom, the benefits of that and also with children that did have a lot of screens, like how that held them back in terms of them being able to be regulated, in terms of them being able to sit through a story that I was telling orally, even with puppets moving, you know, a whole scene, because it wasn't moving fast enough, not as fast as a screen. COVID was interesting because it did have this impact in terms of like just even thinking of early childhood. And so the remote learning, many teachers did as I did. We sent packets home with the children of stories and crafts and things that you may be like recipes that they could make at home. And I recorded stories for children so that the parents could play the stories for them to listen to. And that seemed to go well, but I didn't do anything that they were going to watch on a screen. And in fact, the stories that recorded for the children became the other podcast channel that I have, Stories for Children.
But yeah, I think the greater impact that it had within Waldorf was children, like let's say, in the lower and middle school, because so much of what the teacher needed to present as their main lesson of the day had to be recorded was something that they had to watch. I know some teachers tried their best to work with that, probably with an audio and the visual. I think maybe what a lot of people may not be aware of is that even before COVID, when my children were in like eighth grade and then into high school, they were on the computer with limited time, it wasn't just free reign to do research and to gather information or to do homework. Most of their homework wasn't sent via the email or that they had to do on their laptops. But I think people think that within Waldorf, it's like no screens forever. But it's more of this high or deep intention as to what the goals are. And that is to meet the child developmentally in a way where they're really supporting their growth and their development in their mind, in their body, in their soul. And that's where the holistic perspective comes in on all levels in everything that is decided. I hope I answered this- it's just a lot I could touch on.
Hunter (33:40.654)
Stay tuned for more Mindful Mama podcasts right after this break.
Yeah, I mean, I imagine, I imagine a lot of the parents, you know, maybe were all in, maybe did not have a lot of screen exposure at home, but I imagine there were some that did. And I wonder if you could, you know, was there a difference in kids that came in? It's interesting to see because it does seem, yeah, it seems like bringing it in a little bit. A big influence on me was Kim John Payne’s “Simplicity Parenting”, and his stance is Waldorf influence and saying, “no screens before the age of seven”. And I thought that was kind of bananas. And for a kid, isn't this day and age? And also it's a lot. Also, I think it's, it's high demand on parents and caregivers. You know, it's wonderful if you're a Silicon Valley exec and you can pay like a wonderful nanny to take care of your kids who's holistic and screen free. And that's great. But if you're a parent who's working from home and has to take a meeting with your boss and you have a six-year-old around the house, it might be time for Bluey. You know, I don't know. just, it sounds like it's, it could be a lot. I mean, how do, how can parents kind of maintain a balance between these sort of holistic ideals of, you know, those anchors of time and nature and time for sleep and time for unstructured play and things like that, and yet also balance a life where they're working and meeting demands outside of this.
Chinyelu Kunz:
Very good question. think, I think, you know, let's see how to approach answering your question. But so I'll start here. So I was a stay at home mom for a number of years. up until my third child entered into first grade, and then I started working at the Walder school. And up until that time, I was able to maintain, at least in my children's early childhood years, no screen time. So first, know, my son and then my other two girls who came, I held that. My son, in this day and age, I know it's so much harder. My son did not have screen time until he was nine when he saw his first movie in black and white that my husband chose, an old one from the 50s.
Hunter (37:51.138)
But did you never go to a restaurant that had a screen?
Chinyelu Kunz:
Yeah, no, yeah at home. Yeah, because I do very much so believe that what happens at home is what sets the stage in terms of family values that happens at home. can't make other people do what we want them to do. So our family values. And so what I found was that with my son, not having any screen time when he was little, even at two years old, he didn't rely on that and I didn't want him to come to rely on that at all. There was no time screen time was ever scheduled in and I just never turned it on. And so he was able to play and be deep in his imagination such that I could, even when he was around two and a half, I could take care of some self-care needs, do cooking, cleaning, do other things. And I was even, I'm an architect by education and I would take on various projects on my own from time to time. I could work on that and he would play because that's what was the norm for him. And that is also what helped him to be so self-regulated and be able to occupy his own time and not come looking for me to entertain him or turn on something to entertain him. And there was just such beauty in that he could be in deep play for an hour before coming to me and needing something.
And so I continued this with my two girls. And the same thing. And what I found that was also so beautiful is that it helped them to form and bond relationships with each other because they spent a lot of time playing with each other and talking and working things out. If there were arguments, know, or whatever would come up or come to me or work it out on their own, which I finding out now that they're thirty-four, and thirty-one, and twenty-six that some of these decisions that they made among each other that I had no idea about because they were working it out among the three of them.
And so I, this is what I believe, Hunter. I believe that a lot of parents don't have the sense, don't have the belief that their child is actually capable of being without screen time. And so that then causes them to want to rely on it. I'll turn this on for you. But young children, the youngest even, are so capable. But we don't give them that space and that time. And it's, you know, I know it's not easy and yet, I always encourage parents to try it, give it a try, because it got to the place very quickly as a teacher in the classroom, where out of the fourteen children, I could, in my mind, say to myself, this one has screen time, that one doesn't. That one's got a lot of screen time. And it really showed itself when it was time to sit down for story time. It was so pronounced, so, so pronounced that you just knew it. Yeah, and so that for me was really the evidence that I needed to see on top of the research that I was reading. It was so, it was visible.
Hunter:
Yeah, I have no argument for you because we feel it. You know, anybody who has a smartphone, who has stuff and, you know, I mean, dear listeners, you listen to podcasts. Sometimes I'm like, I want to get a simplified dumb phone for lack of better word. But then I'm like, wouldn't it be weird if I was a podcast? I'm I couldn't listen to podcasts? That would be so strange. But, and I probably will continue to try to be mindful about the effects and things like that, but I really look forward to the times where I'm disconnected. Like I really look forward to those times and carve those out. I worry that as a society, we're getting so used to this level of distraction and this, and I can feel the inability to focus. And the way your brain, know, that dopamine hit of wanting more of that distraction, right? And the inability to enjoy simple things, but then you're the phone, it's not like it's this rich object that is pulling your distraction. It's just like a sub-par substitute for real world engagement. It uses up all our energy for engagement. And so then people are not engaging with each other in real life. I'm really worried about that. Sometimes the listeners tell me like, I want you to push back a little more on your guests. But I don't have any argument for you, you know, because I can see it and feel it in myself. And so of course, with a developing brain that much more, we're gonna see it and feel it, I don't know. It's really, I think, the way we are as a human species.
Chinyelu Kunz:
It is. I've written in the past about how, you know, why I didn't choose screen time for my children. And one of the main reasons was that, and Waldorf does talk about this, that a child who can have a childhood, especially when you think of those early childhood years, screen free, their imagination is growing, developing, and they're also able to have their own thoughts without those as Waldorf- as often said in Waldorf, those pre-digested thoughts and ideas of somebody else. They get to have their own thoughts and dream up their own dreams and their own ideas. And that's what I wanted for my children. also wanted them to be able to examine what was being told to them.
And here's a very interesting story: when my children were young, we lived in Southern California and my husband was on ski patrol up at Big Bear Mountain. And so we would go up there skiing on his rotation. And one time we stayed at somebody's cabin. They were like, stay in our cabin. We've got lots of room. And they had brought up their grandchild and then they put on a movie, which I never did for my children. And so we all sat there and as the movie, before the movie started, the grandmother said, this is, or the mother was like, I was told this is a very child-friendly movie and everything about it, you know, is very child-friendly and not scary. And I don't know what other words she said. At that point, at that time, I only had two children. My son was, I believe, five or six years old. And the movie gets started and he starts. I bet it wasn't. There's only one completely non-scary movie and that's Mary Poppins. Just saying. As the movie was playing on, my son had all these questions for her. He said, that's, that's really kind of scary. I thought you said this wasn't scary. thought, da da da da da. And he questioned the movie at, you know, as it was playing and kept asking her like, what is that supposed to be about? I thought that that da da da da da. And my husband and I just sat there quiet and our younger daughter, she was not interested, so she was just kind of playing with her socks or mittens. And then finally, I think it was the grandmother. The grandmother looked at us, she said, I'm going to take it off. Because at one point she just got so flustered, goes, I don't know, I don't know, they told me. And then my son was like, who's they? I think I'm going to take it off and you guys can play. And I thought, my husband and I, I thought to myself, we both thought like, it was fantastic to see him question and not just accept what was there being shown to him. And so that to me kind of highlights where we want our children to be: in their own thinking minds and not just accepting, this has been put out and they say, yes, it's for my age, I can watch it. So I'll just accept that.
Hunter:
I have a similar story for you at a different age: my daughter had a smartphone. she was fourteen or fifteen. She's 18 now. At one point she got TikTok because everybody her age had TikTok. She had TikTok, I don't know, maybe six months. And then she was like, I don't think I like the way this feels. She's like, I don't. And she took off TikTok and she's never had it on her phone again. And I thought, my God. Thank God she's like evaluating this, you know, and has a self-awareness to see how this feels. mean, you know.
Chinyelu Kunz:
I'm glad you said that, self-awareness. Yeah, that's huge.
Hunter (48:57)
Well, we have talked about so much the rhythm, the wall dark, the screens. Is there anything that we missed, Chinyelu, that you would like to share with the listener? Again, Chinyelu's book is “The Little Book of Parenting: How to Nurture Your Child to Their Full Potential”. And you can find it anywhere books are sold.
Chinyelu Kunz:
I suppose maybe what I could add is that “The Little Book of Parenting” was something that all the topics in there, something that was just really growing in me from my years of experience with world of education. I first stepped into world of education in 1992. And that's when I, it was new to me and learning about it. Cause my educational background, I grew up and was educated in Nigeria, first in a Nigerian school and then an American school. But most of my years there in a Nigerian school system, was off of like the British school system. So very intense, extremely rigorous. And I remember at age fifteen, going to my mom and saying, “Is education only about memorization and regurgitation? There's got to be something else out there”. And so already, even at age fifteen, it was something that was as a question that was living in me. And then when I came upon wall of education through a friend, I thought, wow, this is it. This is it. I need to learn more. So I had no intentions of becoming a teacher at all, because I already had completed my degree in architecture at that point. But it just drew me in and I really wanted it for my son at that time and then it was almost two, not quite, and then of course for my two girls. so the little book of parenting was just something like right from the beginning that, like I said, was just really growing in me. And so was so excited to have been approached by a publisher, be able to write that book and it just, not saying every part of it was easy, but it flowed. And what I really wanted the message in that book is to be able to empower parents to know that they are essentially the guiding light for their children. And they have the wisdom, the inner wisdom to make the decisions that will help their child develop into their full potential. Now, yes, of course, we do need to be able to have something that helps us in that. And in my situation, it was World of Education. I think for other parents, it's something else. Yeah, so I hope that parents will, if they don't already find the book, purchase the book, listen to the audio, if that's a better way where I recorded it, was able to do that, which was grueling but wonderful at the same time. And to know, like, with what I'm offering, that they can be empowered.
Hunter:
Well, thank you so much for coming on, sharing your time and sharing your experience and wisdom with me. It's really been a pleasure, Chinyelu. Thank you.
Chinyelu Kunz:
Thank you. Thank you, Hunter. Thank you for having me.
Hunter (52:47)
I hope you enjoyed this episode. Tell me about it. I'm @MindfulMamaMentor on Instagram, although they're a little less yesterday. I might have mentioned my daughter took bunch of my apps off my phone, which I'm really happy about. If you want more of episodes like this, I invite you to check out, know, I know the Mindful Mama Podcast has so many episodes because we've been around for a long time, but we have a quiz for you: you can go to MindfulMamaMentor.com/quiz, answer a few easy questions, and you're gonna get a unique-to-you, five episode playlist of the Mindful Mama Podcast. And you'll find episodes on how to discipline without punishment, helping kids calm down, how to talk to littles, overcoming overwhelm, all things like that. So it's at MindfulMamaMentor.com/quiz. And if you could share it, that'd be great.
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Anyhow, wishing you a great week. I hope that you have some rhythm and stability in your home and I hope this has supported you and your family in a way that just makes you feel more relaxed and at ease in parenting because that's what our kids need from us, right? They need us to show them model for them how to navigate this crazy world. Wishing you all the best, my friend. Namaste.
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